My World Gathering

A couple of days ago I received the following email from Llyn Richards (Aotearoa / NZ Yearly Meeting Clerk). I asked his permission to post it here because I found it really fascinating and thought others would too!

Dear Leith,

I was delighted to get your report and inspired by its contents!

I am very glad you have sent it to the newsletter and would have recommended that if you had not thought of that already -- the Newsletter gets to a lot more Friends than the YM Clerk's Monthly Letter. However,if the Newsletter does not want it (why not, good heavens? Space perhaps) then I will put in my letter with great pleasure. I send out 180 paper copies and 120 by e-mail.

I would like to hear you some time on how you distinguish a non-theist Q from an atheist Q. I have for a while been a 'lurker' on the USA-based Non-theist Friends' e-mail discussion list. They seem to be a very mixed bunch (typically Q, eh?!) with most contributers being very keen to talk about the route they took in becoming non-theist (jargon: spiritual journey) and in the harassment they get from their meetings -- they must be rather outspoken since I have been 'eldered' only twice for my views. They are about to put out a real book but when I asked about what sort of contibutions they wanted they were all about personal 'spiritual journeys' and not about the REASONS for non-theism or the replacement 'faith', 'godless-theology', 'philosophy', or whatever, that makes them still call themselves Quakers. You touch on those matters in your report. Hooray.

Judith and I particularly liked your quoting of Penn -- Quakers are people are trying what love can do. That may just be enough to distinguish non-theist Qs from humanists.

However, my own reply to those who ask me why I am a Quaker (most are not asking about my funny beliefs, which they probably have not heard. Yet!) I usually reply, 'The Society is my support group.' (possibly now old fashioned pop-psychology jargon but I think you understand.)

I got fed up with the Presbyterians (both my father and grandfather were presby clergymen) mostly because the rank and file were unaware how they said they had certain, mostly moral, beliefs but their practice denied it, also because the highly educated clergy at that time were mostly liberal if not revolutionary in theology but they did not explain why they did not believe in virgin births, etc., to the people in the pews. So I looked around for 'church people' (an all-white Springbock tour was looming) who would peacefull protest with all their might. 70-year-old Betty Fowler made herself a batton-proof boob-protector out of rolled up newspapers sewn into a jacket and we, along with all those other good citizens, showed Muldoon what we thought of Apartheid. For other reasons as well, Qs fitted like a glove. But having a bunch of people who wanted to do what I was willing to do on my own, if necessary, was a tremendous comfort. Something like your experience of belonging, ev en among the disparate majority. 'Look how these Christians love one another."

Sorry about the spiritual journey! But it was trying to make a point. On the whole non-programmed non-birthright Friends are comfortable with making up their own minds, but they need help (who doesn't?) with their concerns.

And it was good to see you taking note of the problems of air-travel, scientific and economic. The electronic communications are going to be a great thing when planes are grounded by pandemics and terribly expensive oil and climate change. BUT did you notice at Yearly Meeting that the moment it was suggested that we should cut down on air travel by New Zealand Quakers, the excuses about how spiritually important face to face contact is for the people getting that. I have no trouble with the importance but morality (and this is reflected in the law) is mostly about weighing the consequences of actions: pushing children about is generally immoral unless it is pushing a child out of the path of a speeding car. Killing people is wrong but at the edges the morality get blurred - euthenasia and abortion. A trip half way wound the world by jet to a committee meeting that can be done by tele-conferencing by people who have mostly met before is miles different from getting 200 YFs together for a once-in-a-life-time experience. But even the latter needs some payback in working for conservation -- and this you have begun in your report.

I once wondered if (1) the recent scientific discoveries about what life was like in the year 30 and (2) the scientific disentanglement of gospel stories so that we have about 90 sayings which can be reasonably attributed to Jesus and pictures of what the early Christians (despite Paul) thought about him; I once wondered if these good solid facts could be a basis for a reprochement between evangelical Qs and those not so inclined -- the Bible-based learning what the real Jesus was like and starting to ignore the 'Son of God' Pauline interpretation; and the spiritually inclined learning what Jesus was really like and finding him much more down to earth and worth listening to than before. But it looks like a longer job that I, or the world, has time for.

Sorry to have rambled on so. I'll have a look at your blog soonish.

Now get back to that doctorate -- its a great boost to confidence when you get it done.

Walk cheerfully

Llyn P.S. My doctoral thesis was on logic and theology -- it summed up my spiritual journey to a non-theist quaker position in 400 pages!! Mind you, I made the journey 30 years ago so writing it just helped me get my ideas straight: theism is too illogical to be correct -- if there is a God he/she is not a theist. But such a conclusion is of very little moral worth and certainly no practical use to a world bent on letting itself go to wrack and ruin.

"It's being so cheerful as keeps me going."